Bradley Byrne: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to the Mobile Matters podcast powered by the Mobile Chamber, where we’re diving deeper into important topics that make a significant impact on Mobile’s thriving business community. I’m your host and president and CEO of the Mobile Chamber, Bradley Byrne. On today’s episode, we get to sit down with a member of our business community, who is who has his eye on the future and has several different projects underway here in Mobile.

From the South Alabama Logistics Park to the Riverwalt Plaza along our downtown waterfront, I’m pleased to welcome Philip Burton with Burton Property Group. Philip, thanks for joining us.

Philip Burton: Thank you for having me. Glad to be here!

Bradley Byrne: Well, we’ve been waiting for this for a long time. I know you’ve got a lot going on.

Uh, why don’t you, before we get started, just share with everybody a little bit about what’s your background. How’d you get to where you are? So, I’m a

Philip Burton: Mobile native, uh, born and raised fifth generation, uh, and [00:01:00] spent, uh, the last twenty three years in commercial real estate, uh, but before that, uh, I spent a little time on the West Coast trying to be a movie star.

That’s great. So, failed actor turned to real estate developer. So, moved back home in, uh, the early 2000s and, uh, just kind of got my Wet with the family business, which at the time was real estate investing. We weren’t really developing. Uh, we were, I had great exposure to real estate investments from, uh, retail to roll land to hospitality.

So, uh, we were primarily a financial partner in projects and not necessarily the development partner. Uh, but that was what my exposure was. And that’s what really got me interested in real estate development. I wanted to be the person developing the project, not necessarily just the one being the passive investor.

Bradley Byrne: Well, Hollywood’s loss is our gain. So we’re glad to know about that. Okay. So, um, y’all are one of the largest real estate development firms in [00:02:00] South Alabama. And as you said, it all started with family owned business. So how did you evolve from family owned business to real estate to now being a major real estate developer?

Philip Burton: Uh, As I like to say, from bread to buildings, so, uh, so the family bakery, uh, Smith’s Bakery, a fixture here in town, uh, was sold in the late 80s. Uh, and my great aunt and great grandmother, who were direct descendants of Gordon Smith, the founder of Smith’s Bakery, tasked my dad to basically reinvest the proceeds from the sale.

Uh, so in the early 90s, uh, my dad began to kind of pursue it or look into different investment opportunities. And one of the first investment opportunities was a bankrupt shopping center down in Destin, florida, which turned into Silver Sands Outlet Malls. So back in 91, uh, he went down to Destin and saw an opportunity to invest in [00:03:00] a, in a vacant shopping center.

It was an A& P grocery store actually. Uh, and there was a clause in the A& P grocery lease that says, you know, if a competing grocer opens up, they don’t have to move in. And when Dixie announced and basically the grocery store, the A and P said, we’re not coming in. So the original developer lost that shopping center back in the late eighties.

This is long time ago. Uh, and uh, we were there to kind of pick it up. So bought that shopping center and redeveloped it with Keith Howard, our partner back then and uh, took it from essentially 70, 000 square feet of vacant. Nothing to a half a million square feet of designer outlet, uh, retailers over 21 years.

Bradley Byrne: So, ultimately, you formed, formed your present company, Burton Property Group. What does Burton Property Group do?

Philip Burton: So, uh, over the years, so that, so that company that did the Silver Sands deal was a family entity called MCS. [00:04:00] And over the years, we, uh, Uh, kind of assembled more and more shares and whittled it down to the Burton family.

So back in 2012, we’ve rebranded the company to Burton Property Group, uh, and that’s when I kind of took, took the lead as the CEO and president of the company and really at that point decided that, you know, if we’re going to make investments, if we’re going to bet on people, let’s bet on ourselves. So let’s pursue investment and development opportunities where we’re the lead developer Uh, and so one of the first projects that we, we undertook was the Westwood Plaza Shopping Center in 2012, we purchased that and redeveloped it into what it is today, which we essentially doubled it in size.

Uh, but we, we had an opportunity to look at different markets that we’re to invest and, uh, you know, I, I kept coming back to mobile. And I was like, look, there’s a lot going on here. There’s a lot of potential. And, uh, it was shortly thereafter, I think Airbus announced the final [00:05:00] assembly plant. And it’s hard to believe if within 12 years, kind of where we are today.

I mean, we, we, we got lucky. Uh, but we made, we made a good investment long term, I think.

Bradley Byrne: Well, uh, people say they get lucky if, I say people make their own luck, because it’s a whole lot of hard work that went into that. You didn’t just wake up one day and say, oh look, I got lucky. Yeah. A lot went into that.

Let’s talk about one of your, your new, um, announcements. It’s exciting to a lot of, this is a big deal. It, it’s a big project. It’s not, it’s going to happen overnight. But, but talk to us about Riverwalt Plaza. What is it? Where will it be? A little bit about the timeline, if you can.

Philip Burton: Yeah, absolutely. So, hard to believe that that project, we have been now working on it for over two years.

This December, uh, it’ll be announced, or it will be the one year anniversary since the public announcement. Hard to believe. Uh, we hope, uh, that within the next few weeks, Knock on Wood will be in front of the City Council to approve the agreement to [00:06:00] actually acquire the land and actually move forward with due diligence.

Bradley Byrne: And tell us where the land is.

Philip Burton: The land is, uh, It’s the vacant parcel adjacent to the north side of the convention center. So

Bradley Byrne: right on the

Philip Burton: river, right there on the river, it’s the only undeveloped piece of property that touches the river in downtown Mobile. Wow. Which is pretty remarkable for a port city like us.

And you know, if you go and visit Savannah, their, their waterfront is, is active. They’ve got restaurants and bars and, uh, you know, hotels that touch the water. Uh, we don’t have that luxury. We’ve got some. public amenities, but nothing that really, nothing to really do per se down there. So when presented the opportunity to do something, uh, you know, we were like, look, we got to go big or go home because if you have this unique opportunity to take something that is, you know, we’re all, you know, want to be close to the water.

I mean, it’s just in our DNA. If you can create an environment that has all these types of uses from [00:07:00] Retail, hospitality, to office, to residential. Uh, you can create a pretty unique experience and give a reason for people to go down there. here. Uh, so that was what drew us to the opportunity is like, look, this is this is the only one.

This isn’t like we’re going to have to go and compete with other sites that are up and up and down the river. This is it. So this is an incredible opportunity. And so I partnered with Laura Kessler, who’s the Kessler group that developed the Grand Bohemians up in, uh, well, there’s one in Birmingham and, uh, Charleston and Savannah.

Uh, and she’s been a fantastic partner and a great resource because she brings that component to the. to the project team. Uh, it was her and her consultants that really kind of took the Our concept, which was doing something big and really putting the flair to it, uh, and so when we announced December of last year was really more about vision setting, like, Hey, we’re going to talk, you know, this is what we want to do, but there’s a lot that has to happen with that [00:08:00] project and that’s,

Bradley Byrne: that’s why I wanted to talk about the timeline.

We want everybody to understand you can’t just walk up to the waterfront and build whatever you want and snap your fingers. There’s a lot of moving parts here. What does it look like? What do you know? No, I’m not holding you to anything. There’s no, you’re not going to be held to this, but sort of help all the rest of us understand.

What do you think it’s going to take and how long? Sure.

Philip Burton: So let’s start with what we envision the program to be. And when I use the term program, that means, you know, what are the different project pieces that we want to see on the site? So we’ve got an office component, about 50, 000 square feet of office.

We’ve got a hotel component, which is about 120 key hotel. We’ve got about 60 condominiums, so a residential component, and then about 10, 000 square feet of FB& E, food, food, beverage, and entertainment. So all that fits within that site. The biggest challenge of that site, as you know, is the CSX rail line that runs right through the [00:09:00] middle of it.

Yeah. Along and parallel Water Street, so you’ve got two major pieces of infrastructure that we have to contend with that. We’ve been working really hard with our partner, the city of Mobile, to figure out how we can design around that and bring this project to a reality and make it appealing. And from a pedestrian perspective, because we did what we did not want to do.

is attach a building to the end of the convention center and say, okay, everybody come on down and join us. No, we wanted it to be a welcoming environment and give reason for folks to want to walk down all the way dolphins all the way down Dolphin Street and make that make that cross of Water Street.

And we think we’ve got it figured out and we’re, we’re, it has not been unveiled yet. So leave a little breadcrumbs here. But we think we’ve got something really special that is going to completely transform the pedestrian experience on how to access the waterfront.

Bradley Byrne: And hopefully kickstart a true Riverwalk experience there, [00:10:00] starting at your development going south.

Which is why the Chamber Leadership Exchange trip is going to San Antonio to see their RiverWalk. Not that we’re going to copy their RiverWalk, but that’s a great opportunity for us to start a conversation. Alright, Phillip’s made this step, what’s our, as a community’s next step, because your development’s not going to work sitting there by itself.

Exactly. We’ve got to have more there. Okay, it’s time for a brief sponsor break. When we come back, we’re going to take a closer look at Mobile’s logistics industry. And the role of the South Alabama Logistics Department plays in

Advertisement: that. Attention mobile businesses. The Mobile Chamber is excited to introduce MobileMetrics.

Your new go to source for vital economic, workforce, and industry data. Discover everything from cost of living to top employers all in one place. [00:11:00] Whether you’re a business owner, investor, or just curious, MobileMetrics has you covered. Visit mobileeconomicdevelopment. com And click mobile metrics today.

Empower your business decisions with the latest data from Mobile’s trusted source, the Mobile Chamber. That’s mobileeconomicdevelopment. com. Your data, your growth, your future.

Bradley Byrne: We’re back on the Mobile Matters podcast. We’re here with Philip Barton of Barton Property Group. So, Phillip, logistics is a growing industry here in Mobile, and one of your properties is playing a major role, the South Alabama Logistics Park.

Tell our listeners more about what that project is.

Philip Burton: Sure. So, uh, South Alabama Logistics Park, a 1, 300 acre master plan industrial park, which is the largest between Houston, Texas and Jacksonville, Florida. I didn’t know that. Wow. Cool. And, uh, it can contain up to 12 [00:12:00] million square feet of industrial warehouse products.

The entire thesis behind this project was really around three things. One, the growing port, which, as we all know, is the fastest growing containerized port in America in percentage volume. Uh, two, Airbus and the growing supply chain, and three, just general manufacturing interests that wanted to be within the Sunbelt.

You know, having a port is a huge, huge asset to this community. And, not having sites or facilities available to meet the needs of whatever company that wanted to locate here, whether it’s warehouse distribution or manufacturing assembly or an Airbus related supplier. We saw a huge need or an opportunity rather, uh, to be able to put something together of scale.

Uh, real estate is all about scale. Uh, to be able to be position ourselves to be that point of call for any company that wanted to come into the into the really the region because this isn’t just like a [00:13:00] mobile county or, or South Alabama. This is really a region regional play. Um, and yeah, it’s been a long another long effort.

We’re going into our seventh year of this particular project. We’re three years from actually. have closed in and and have begun on it but it took five years before that to get to where we are today but we’ve got three facilities up all of which are leased over a hundred million investment over a hundred million dollars invested and have created over 230 jobs

Bradley Byrne: right and that’s what people don’t understand is that a warehouse is not an inert building Warehouse has to have people that take things to and from, move things around inside, do things to the stuff once it gets inside.

So, you know, we see that clearly here at the Chamber, and that’s one of the reasons we’re so excited about it. So, um, one thing about that, about that whole industry that still fascinates me, is that most of these buildings are [00:14:00] built on spec. And I remember the first time you told me that, I said, you make money off of that?

But apparently it is the way this industry works around the country. Yeah.

Philip Burton: So when a company wants to, wants to actually, uh, arrive in a market. I mean, they’re, they’re looking to take action. And so not having a facility up or a path ready to go, uh, your chances of landing that opportunity really are greatly diminished.

But if you look at other port markets, I mean, and I draw a pretty close comparison to Savannah because I feel like we are Savannah, uh, 15 years ago. Uh, without sites or facilities to handle the containerized cargo, the port can’t grow. I mean, they are a symbiotic relationship. And when Walmart announced in 2016, that was the market telling us something, because Walmart, the leader in e commerce, the leader in retail, said we’re going to come to Mobile and open, you know, one of the largest [00:15:00] distribution centers in our footprint.

Uh, they have, I think, I want to say seven of that size mobile being the largest that one user brings 70, 000 or I think 75, 000 boxes a year. Wow. That one retailer and they’re in two and a half million square feet. So if you do the math, 70, 000 boxes a year and two and a half million square feet, that’s like 30 square feet per box.

And if we’re going to grow by another million, two million boxes, That’s a lot of warehouse space that we need.

Bradley Byrne: Yeah, I always, every time you bring up how many square feet that is, I start losing my breath. So I’ve heard it as low as 30, at one point you said 50, and Lee Lawson in Baltimore County two weeks ago said 100 million, and I wanted to slap him upside the face and say, what are you thinking here?

Philip Burton: But it’s also important to manage those expectations because none of this happens overnight. Oh, it takes a long time to get there. But we have to position [00:16:00] ourselves for that growth. Right. And we’re, I think we’re fortunate in the timing of, of where we are in the market. I mean, we’re established, we’ve got three facilities up, but there’s going to be the need for other, other parks like Salp.

And you’re beginning to hear about them. Right. You know, Lee Lawson’s the, the project that the Baldwin County EDA announced. Yep. I think Scannell’s got a project further, uh, east than us, but you know, the market’s going to need it over the long term. And having other parks, having other developers in the market, putting eyes on the market is a good thing.

Now, as a market, can we absorb millions and millions of square feet in one year? No, absolutely not. We are still in the infancy of everything. Right. But over the long term, we absolutely, I see the need and it’s going to be there. It’s absolutely going to be there. Wow,

Bradley Byrne: just amazing. All right, we’ve had some recent announcements for you.

Let’s make sure that we talk about those. So, um, [00:17:00] I call it VEYR.

Philip Burton: VEYR is the, is the logistics arm for Office Depot. Okay. I call it Office Depot. Okay.

Bradley Byrne: So what is this development?

Philip Burton: So Office Depot, uh, and we’re very excited about this announcement. So Office Depot, which currently, uh, uses, they’ve got a DC in Jacksonville, Mississippi.

They are relocating it to Mobile. So new to Mobile, Alabama. Uh, and they’re going to start shifting cargo out of Jacksonville, Florida into Mobile. Uh, and I’ll never forget touring the building with, with the leadership team for Office Depot. I mean, they very quickly pointed out, well, Walmart’s down the street.

This facility works for us because it works for Walmart. Having them already established in the market, I mean, it really takes a lot of the guesswork for these retailers who are looking to use Mobile as a containerized port market. So having them here really kind of check the box for these guys, but that’s just one other retailer and it’s just like building blocks.

You know, we, we get, we’ve [00:18:00] got Walmart, we’ve got Amazon and we’ve got office depot. I mean, that gives us the ability to go make the case to the other retailers that are out there that are going to want to need to expand or differentiate their supply chain and having mobile as an option, you know, probably A few years ago, it wasn’t really top of mind, but now that we’ve gotten the traction, it’s an easier sell.

It’s a

Bradley Byrne: much easier sell. So you told me this one time, what’s the drive time from the gate at the port out to South Alabama? 11 minutes. 11 minutes? Yeah. So I know it’s a lot longer than that in Savannah for most places.

Philip Burton: In different parts, there are parts, parks, and we did this research just the other day, uh, there are parks that are 45 miles outside of, of Savannah.

Wow. I mean, in, in last year, I want to say Savannah built in one year over 13 million square feet. In one year. I know. That’s the equivalent of one entire park. So, over the long term, as the market matures, as [00:19:00] more and more, uh, retailers and, and the shipping lines start calling on Mobile, which, as you know, we’re going through a, a, a infrastructure project where we’re deepening and widening our, our, our channel.

Which will make mobile the deepest in the Gulf of Mexico. That’s a huge deal. Why is that such a big deal? Well, all the ships that are going to call on mobile can all upsize and be the deepest and the widest in the Gulf of Mexico. So that means that we can become the first port of call. So the boats will come here heavy.

And when they come here fully loaded, they’re going to dump that cargo. That cargo just doesn’t go straight to the business. It goes to a warehouse where it’s unpacked and then distributed. So, once that project is completed, I’m, it’s not going to be instantaneous, but that’s going to be a huge watershed event for this market to where all of a sudden we can start promoting ourselves as being the deepest and widest.

We can handle the heavy boats, and oh, by the way, we have the facilities and the [00:20:00] sites for your distribution centers if you wanted to pick Mobile.

Bradley Byrne: So, uh, just in general, just look down the road a little bit, and, and tell me, How big do you think this logistics business can be for Mobile?

Philip Burton: It’s hard to say, but I would, I would be just at Salp.

I believe there’s going to be over 5, 000 people working in that park.

Bradley Byrne: And that’s our, our figures show the same thing, 5, 000. In one

Philip Burton: park. In one park. And that’s 5, 000, and that’s just direct jobs. The indirect that will support the trucks, the, the, you know, the maintenance, all of the interior, you know, components to all of these warehouses, which these aren’t just like dusty old warehouses, no, there’s assembly operations, I mean, there’s, there’s technology that’s in these buildings that need to be serviced, I mean, it’s, it’s the, the industry has transformed over

Bradley Byrne: the last few years.

We’ve got a, uh, a great member here at the chamber. that makes the doors and the door mechanisms. You wouldn’t think [00:21:00] that would be that big a business, but it’s a huge business, and we’re lucky to have all of them. Well, Philip, thank you so much for being here. We can’t wait to see the Riverwalk Plaza go vertical, not hold you to any timelines.

We also look forward to many more announcements for all the companies coming to support. Let me just say this one thing. You not only believe in Mobile, You’ve put your money on the line, okay? So that tells me that you’re not just talking about stuff from your heart, you’re also talking about stuff from your head.

When your head and your heart line up, it’s kind of hard to stop Philip Barton, so. We can’t wait to see what’s coming in the future. So folks that brings us to the end of this week, this month’s episode from the heart of the mobile business community. This is the Mobile Matters Podcast powered

by the Mobile Chamber [00:22:00] .